EDMC insiders report layoffs underway

1. worst decision I ever made was accepting a position in admissions w/ Ai OHE, handing my “manager” my resignation one morning the best decision I ever made professionally

   deceptive “recruiting” practices, management that routinely mismanaged and verbally abused staff, an absolute disregard for students and their success, lead generation that came from using spam emailing outfits, senior management rewarded for deceptive practices and production and not because they deserved to be managing employees, and so on and so on

   it was all about getting the student to sign those loan documents as soon as possible, it was about manipulating parents into signing loan agreements where they were responsible for the debt

   the “admissions requirements” were a complete joke, no one was denied admissions, or close to no one. I felt ashamed for “recruiting” students who obviously were not meant to pursue an online post-secondary education/degree because they would not be able to sustain the coursework and did not have the academic background to succeed in the programs

   I can easily understand the sentiments of those who were let go today and can only hope that the friends I have left there make the right decision for the careers and personal reputation and leave Ai OHE before the smack down comes from the fed govt in terms of striping their fin aid funding

2. EDMC is AWESOME!!!

   “manipulating parents into signing loan agreements”, “did not have the academic background to succeed in the programs”….huh? Maybe people aren’t as stupid as you think. Maybe those people made informed decisions about going to EDMC, and maybe those people did well at EDMC and just can’t find a job in this economic climate. Alot of people from state colleges can’t find a job either, and they are GIVEN $ from the govt. with little strings attached.

   Just go find another job….if you are as good as you think you are, you won’t have a problem.

3. I quit almost 2 years ago because I couldn’t stand deceiving people any more (and I was good at it- which made me feel even worse). It turns out that what they are doing is not only shady and morally wrong, it’s actually illegal. It’s illegal to pay recruiters based solely on the number of students they recruit. Remember those “quality points” on the matrix? Where those EVER mentioned in reviews? No. Your director asks you how much you want to make, and then gives you an exact number of students you have to enroll. That’s why they’re laying people off – the DOJ is finally on to them. Everyone who is lucky enough to have a job at the end of today should be looking for something else, because it won’t be long before there’s another round of layoffs.

4. Haterz gonna hate

5. All who are commenting need to have some facts straight prior to opening thier rather large and uneducated mouths…If you HATE the business that pays your bills than dont work there…SIMPLE as THAT!

6. Yes I do remember those “Matrix Points.” You have not worked here in two years to know that they did away with the matrix. They are making the changes necessary to be compliant with the federal rules and regulations. Was for-profit education a joke and did it screw a lot of people? Yes. Has the company made and are still making changes to weed out the “stipend chasers” or the “just another number?” Yes. Sorry if you are one that lost your job today. It was very hard to see that happen. I was fortunate enough to walk away with a job today. I am thankful for that. I have bills to pay. At the end of the day, I know that I am doing what is right for my students. That is all that matters to me. Everyone else should have the same mentality working in this field. Just do what is right.

7. “Haters”, that’s quite a silly comment. In today’s economy ( or any economy for that matter) people don’t always have the luxury of working for a company that they like. I worked for EDMC for over 3 years, and the more I learned about the organization, the more I learned to hate it. I found another job, but it took me over a year. Both of my grandfathers busted their butts in the Mills. I know they didn’t like working there, but you do what you need to do to survive. I am sure alot of people across the world “hate” the company they work for but need the money. It’s not a perfect world.

8. All those that worked in Admissions or have any experience with the special interests and strategies the company utilized specific to enrolling those in the military should file should go to this link below and contribute to the fraud evidence in the law suit United States ex rel. Washington et al. v. Education Management Corp. et al., Civil No. 07-461 (W.D. Pa.) http://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/oig/hotline.html

9. In response to “Hate the Haters”, you’re right; I do have a rather big mouth. As for being uneducated, however, I have two Bachelor’s degrees, a Master’s degree, and am currently finishing my PhD at Pitt. As soon as a realized what the company really was, I started looking for another job, and within 6 months I was gone.

   But you’re right – anyone who hates the company should just find another job! Just head on down to jobville and pick a nice, shiny job off of the job tree.

   A company does not stop hurting students and taxpayers just because you leave. The illegal activity continues, and as an ex-employee, that puts me in an excellent position to speak out. So thanks, but I’ll be keeping my “rather large” mouth wide open.

10. Sure- bitter employees can openly state their dissatisfaction with EDMC on the very day they’re let go…but its no coincidence when the glaring majority of feedback, both online and in the Pittsburgh area, is frighteningly negative concerning EDMC’s workplace environment. Its clearly a toxic culture that trickles all the way down. Simply note Exhibit A: the tone in EDMC’s formal statement. Now is probably not the right time to appear defensive (“which will affect fewer than 2% of its 20,000 employees” is still ~400 people, EDMC) and cold. …But hey, at least they let everyone know that the recent layoffs “are not anticipated to have any impact on students!” Wouldn’t want to lose a tuition, would we?

11. I worked there as well – but not in admissoins. It was an easy job to get and they were the only company hiring. I didn’t know much about what was going on in admissions with the students but the drug ring was amazing. The whole company is corrupt. It’s a job – yes. Everybody needs one. Just know that you’re working for a corrupt and unethical entity that will drop you like a bad habit if it saves them a dime.

12. I do hope that the friends I made in the training pod who are still working there are alright, still employed (and working on their resumes). They were the only people I trusted during my employment at Ai OHE.

    As good as my training pod mgr. was, Hetz, I should have known what was in store for me when I learned his background; a successful collections representative. Hetz was a good guy, intense, successful and he knew how to weed out the weak. I don’t regret working w/ him, he was just good at what he did for EDMC.

    When I hit the floor and started working in Admissions I knew w/in a matter of days how deceptive and pushy the Admissions staff had to be to be successful. It was ALL about the #’s, not the students success. It was incredibly demoralizing to stand there at 9AM with your “Director” and other AR’s and have to listen to the senseless pep talks ALL ABOUT PRODUCTION. Listening to and watching people be humiliated.

    I would expand further about the myriad of lies, deceit, humiliation, intimidation and flat out fraud that was perpetrated by Ai OHE AR’s and “Directors”, but it’s not going to change the fact that students are being ripped off daily, lied to daily and pressured into applying to Ai on the first phone call every single day.

    What needs to happen is Washington DC cuts off their financial aid and thus their HUGE profits.

    In the end it was the worst career-related experience in my life to date. I just hope that my prior work experience there does not come back to haunt me, it hasn’t to date, I am gainfully employed in the field of my vast experience. I work for a fantastic company with incredible people. I just hope that everyone let go finds the same for their careers, they deserve it for enduring the hell that was working for EDMC/Ai OHE.

    And if you are thinking about enrolling there, please, come to your senses and don’t, I can attest that you are just a number and not important in the long run. As soon as you sign that MPN you’re screwed.

13. ff0176 SERIOUSLY?!?! EDMC began making those changes you mentioned in REACTION to having a spotlight shining in their direction for abusing federal tax dollars via student financial aid! This was not a proactive decision in advance of such attention. This company specifically hired key players employed by Apollo Group that contributed to the University of Phoenix huge financial growth…..you know that other online for profit university that was found guilty of the very same accusations filed in the complaint against them. NOT COINCIDENTAL! Every change they make is reactionary. Did you actually close your comment with the statement “Just do what is right”? You most certainly aren’t if you are defending an organization the knowingly commits fraud and did so by intentional business strategy. But you tell yourself whatever you need to in order to be at peace with that reality.

14. I worked at EDMC for 4 years. I left voluntarily a few years ago to persue other employment avenues. I feel terrible for all of my peers and old coworkers who lost their jobs today. EDMC was not a bad company to work for. You can read slander and negativity about any company in Corporate America but it is the actions of individuals employed through that company that save face. I know I played by the rules, ethical 100% of the time. There was pressure, its a job. What job does not push you to hit deadlines and goals? Your job is to bring students to school, like it or not thats why you are getting a paycheck. For everyone saying its a scam, learn to do your job better. You can succeed there playing by the rules, I know tons of people who have and still are and sadly some who have who are no longer there. There will be a bad apple in every job you have, I challenge you to find a new job without 1 person learning ways to cheat the system. You cant allow those people to define the entire institution. I am thankful for my time there, and they were good to me. As said above, if you dont like the hand thats feeding you, walk away. No point coming out now to bash a company who paid your way for years and you werent even part of the mess today.

15. Everyone needs to quit whining this happens all the time. Go find a new job instead of crying about it on the Internet.

16. I worked at EDMC in admissions. It should have been -in theory – an extremely rewarding position. In reality, it was the most morally-corrupt place I have ever worked. I left on my own accord a year ago. When I arrived admissions reps were paid based on the number of students that STARTED their first day of class and completed their first assignment. They were HUGELY compensated. Jumping from 35K to 120K in six months was fairly common. this payout caused everyone to talk unqualified students into starting class. Then the compensation plan was adjusted so those high salaries were frozen and everyone else comes in at 40K. So now, big surprise guess who is let go during these layoffs? The guys making 40K or the guys making 120K? The top 5 people I knew who were making the most money have all been fired today for “performance reasons”. That place is so corrupt its amazing.

17. I have worked in Admissions and Advising. There have been lots of changes for the better. All the ‘scammers’ out there are pissed because they got fired. Some of us really care about our students. I love my job every day and the day I feel I am disappointing them will be some day when I have to leave.

18. If you are part of the layoff, contact me, we are hiring as well as others. sjmahoney@gmail.com. Positions in Birmingham, AL and Aurora, CO

19. EDUCATION MGT SOUNDS AS CORRUPT AS EVERY OTHER ORGANIZATION OF IT’S KIND. i AM A VICTIM OF DELTA CARREER EDUCATION MGT. WHO DID NOTHING BUT MAKE EMPTY PROMISES AND ROBBED STUDENTS BLIND. THEY RAN MY SCHOOL INTO THE GROUND WITH THEIR GREED AND IT CLOSED BEFORE I WAS ABLE TO GRADUATE.

20. Corrupt all around. Wait until more comes out.

    Many students were admitted to the online programs who did not have computers and were told to just use their computers at work or some other genius solution. Others were admitted with such low GPAs (1.2, as an example) that there was no way for them to succeed but there was no problem taking their money.

    5.5 week online programs are designed for only the best and most dedicated students, students with a strong support structures…not students with 1.2 GPA’s, two jobs, single parents with multiple children, etc. Students who would obviously need extra help were talked into enrolling in a school and programs with continually shrinking support structures and resources.

    Not surprising…who is blamed for unsuccessful students? FACULTY.

    Somehow faculty who were given a student with a 1.2 GPA were somehow expected to magically educate a student in 5.5 weeks into a C or better grade. If you could not do that you must not be a very good teacher. You’ll be fired in the coming days and weeks. It’s all being tracked but someone forgot to include the student variable.

    Ask EDMC about “rolling starts”…there’s a great news story for you. Let’s get’em in and out as soon as possible by not giving students any time off…sounds like a solid educational experience to me.

    “The nation’s second largest diploma mill…”

21. To So Long EDMC…..I know several people that worked and currently are working as Academic Counselors. They actually had an Admissions Representative enroll a HOMELESS student!!! He reached out to his Academic Counselor one day when he was having trouble accessing his class online…..some genious enrolled him and actually suggested that he could use the computers at the at the public library! If that isn’t predatory I don’t know what is. That AC quit by the way!

22. I worked in admissions at EDMC for about 8 months before I was fired in 2011, for not meeting enrollment numbers. However, I knew what to expect as it was a sales position and you were to recruit students to attend school, it was outlined in the interview and throughout training.

    EDMC is not a sham, however does have some bad apples. Saying the whole company is a sham is like the federal government saying that all for-profit schools are deceptive and bad for students, it’s simply not true.

    I am currently a doctoral student at EDMC’s Argosy University, and I can tell you that the program I am in is both challenging and rewarding. I have worked for a couple different large for-profits, they’re not all bad. Do they make bad decisions sometimes, absolutely. Should people be pissed that they got laid off, you bet. I was pissed when I got fired and I knew it was coming for weeks, it was just a matter of time. Stop painting EDMC with such a broad brush, you demonize those who actually care for their students, and cheapen the hard work and dedication that other students put in to doing well at EDMC schools.

23. There’s nothing wrong with for profit schools, if they are run ethically. But, when you start lowering the bar and letting absolutely anyone in, regardless of their ability to benefit from the education, then there’s a problem.

    EDMC has schools that offer a perfectly legit education. The problem is that they mislead people and are so hungry for the money that they have absolutely NO standards or ethical responsibility to the people that they enroll.

    SOME FUN FACTS:

    1. EDMC took an 11% revenue hit in 2010. This is the real reason behind all of the layoffs and consolidations.

    2. Over 20% of students at the EDMC school I work for have a high school GPA of less than 2.0.

    3. There is no portfolio requirement needed for acceptance.

    4. A bachelor’s degree costs $96,000. The average starting salary of the graduates is $30,000.

    READ THAT LAST ONE AGAIN…THAT’S A VERY BIG DEAL!

    5. EDMC will enroll students up to 2 weeks after classes have started. This results in missing 2 out of 10 classes. Students are still required to pay for the 2 classes they never attended.

    6. EDMC will financially plan students in such a way that they owe money to the school for up to 36 months after graduation in order to lower their payments on the front end so that they can start school.

    This means that they have to pay back their students loans + up to $300 monthly to EDMC. Ouch!

    7. The entire admissions interview is presented to admissions representatives and trained to them as “ammo” to use for “the close” in order to deflect objections and squash reasons the student might have to not apply right there on the spot.

    I could go on and on and on.

    For profit schools are not necessarily bad. Companies like EDMC are bad. The bad ones should be weeded out and shut down…permanently.

24. Shut down EDMC so 20,000 people lose their jobs. That makes a ton of sense. Just perfect, huh? 20,000 more people not able to make their mortgage or rent payments. 20,000 people not able to make their student loan payments or car payments or credit card payments or anything. With unemployment compensation you get $990 biweekly maximum. Now do some math on all of your bills and let me know how far $1980 gets you in a month. Now remember $990 is a maximum and I doubt most folks will qualify for the maximum.

    Then you guys talk about the student they enroll. Who are you to say someone doesn’t deserve a chance at furthering their education? Who are you to tell a single mother that they can’t attend school because they have kids? Who are you to tell a 1.50gpa student they can’t go to school because they messed up in high school? Who are you to tell someone they can’t go to school because you think they’re chasing a stipend check? You guys need to get over yourselves.

    Finally, you talk about representatives not meeting performance goals and act like it’s no big deal. Well guess what, that’s life. If you’re a kicker on the Steelers and miss fieldgoals, you’re let go. If you sell cars, but don’t sell any, you’re let go. If you’re a doctor, but don’t have any patients, you’re out a job. If you work retail and you don’t improve on the results from the year prior, you’re let go. If you own a restaurant, but people don’t eat there, you’re out of a business. The bottom line is, if you don’t meet the expectations of your employer, you’re let go. Simple as that.

    But hey, it’s no big deal. Bash away at the education industry all you want. Pittsburgh has nothing to worry about with all the other businesses booming…

25. You know, all of you who have just been sucker punched by EDMC are in a great position to assist the Dept. of Justice with their current lawsuit! Don’t get mad … get even!

26. I was one of the layoff employees. One of the employees in the room with me just received a trophy last Monday. It was supposed to be a new gesture to award the rep who brought in the most applications for the week…she was laid off, along with other top performers. I’d only been there 7 months but I was hoping to ay least find another job first. Granted I wasn’t the best but I wasn’t bad. If you have no problem sitting on the phone for 8 hours, listening to people hang up, or tell you to stop calling then this is the job for you. I personally will take the severance pay and unemployment until I find something better and and related to my degree. That place truly is a joke. I would say at least half of the people are there only because of the money. I’ve heard it from many people, and many of them don’t even like it there.

27. First of all these were not “lay offs.” people were terminated. Rallied in a meeting room and told they no longer had a job. These were not just people that performed badly or had low enrollments. Some of the people let go had been there for years and had good production. They were let go because they made too much money. These people that lost there job have a right to be bitter and angry. People can say what they will telling people to get over it, but would you get over it if you were told “Hey guess what you’re fired, not because of numbers, not because you’re a bad employee but just because.” Then to add insult to injury you are escorted back to your desk only for you to gather the things you brought with you, told the rest of your things will be boxed and mailed to you and then paraded in front of those that still have jobs right out the door?” When it happens to you then you are entitled to tell someone to get over it. The fact of the matter is that no one will ever truly know why 70+ people lost there jobs today. The truth will never be told and those of us that lost our jobs for no apparent good reason are told eh who cares. Thanks for all of your support Pittsburgh, you’re just as asinine as the senior management at EDMC.

28. I honestly hope all of you that are defending EDMC keep in mind what just happened to you. This company has no loyalty to anyone. They just laid you off and shipped you out like their trash. Its up to you now to talk to the authorities and let them know.

    Students like us, got burned, for a LIFE TIME by these executives scam.

    Don’t let Goldman Sachs use you as an excuse to get away with what they did.

    I seriously hope you reach out to the cases going on and help the students that got utterly destroyed and are damaged for life, if not suicidal thanks to the destruction of their dreams and financial futures all so that people like Todd Nelson and Jock McKernan can have their bonuses.

    Just watch, they’ll all pull their golden parachute and leave you all to dry.

    What you see going on today is nothing more than Bad Captains pushing passengers off a sinking ship so that they can save themselves. Pure and simple.

    If you know what is going on, you need to say something to help justice prevail. It isn’t going to help or hurt your resume.

    EDMC is using these schools as nothing more than an elaborate funnel to get federal money out of poor students and leave them with the bill.

    Its causing real pain. Its ruining lives. Fix it.

29. I have been working with the company for almost two years now and I see myself working here much longer. Every job I have had has goals. You can’t accomplish business plans if you do not set goals. I lost many friends through the layoffs but those individuals were not performing. They had quit doing what was asked months prior. The error is in some of the managers. If these individuals would have been put on an effective corrective plan, they would have been let go when they couldn’t perform. The managers have built relationships with these individuals. Let’s face it, no one wants to terminate someone they have a relationship with but such is business.

    The company itself is not corrupt. I have worked for both profit and non profit business and see corruption throughout. Don’t let one individual ruin a reputation. If you were a former employee and you saw bad things happening, why were you not opinionated enough to speak with a member of Human Resources?

    In regards to our students, I started as a student. Due to circumstances, I have gone to 5 different schools and didn’t settle until I found South University. I now get to offer the support that I didn’t receive from other schools. Our students have to pass exams in order to be accepted. I’ve taken the test and it isn’t the easiest but it truly gauges the students ability.

    When they notified me of the lay-offs, my first concern was my students. I wanted to make sure all transitions would be smooth. You might think of me as being a one-of-kind but I disagree. Yes we were worried about our jobs but we build relationships. I push my students for success well after the first class. If you haven’t been with the company recently you would understand that our goal is getting students to complete successfully, not just enrolling many new students. We also encourage our students to borrow smartly and not take out stipend checks.

    The company wants success. If you can’t abide by those rules, this is not the job for you. If you want to bash a school, why not look at University of Phoenix rates that change after a student has completed the first year. Better yet, look at the schools that have fee’s for everything including technology fee’s, tutoring fee’s, book fee’s, ect.

    I will continue to provide the best service to my students and will encourage individuals who have been told they can’t make it. Anyone trying to pre-determine another individual and tell them no is stifling human growth.

30. Based on the comments, I would say you were let go because the company is under performing and they have a ton of legal troubles ahead. Then, folks like Sharon, suggest you join the fight against EDMC and others, like EDMC is a sham, wishes they lose their federal funding. Lawsuits/Negative press + no federal aid = no students, which = no EDMC OHE. YAY! Let’s eliminate 19,600 more jobs. That’s not including all the vendors associated with the company. Just imagine the volume EDMC does with other companies. So now they’re not meeting their numbers and they lay people off. Great idea, guys.

31. Current EDMC AR, encourage borrowing responsibly? This coming from the same company that has the loan officers filling in the amounts to borrow FOR the students.

    The success of the students is NOT what is in mind. We students can see the truth, unfortunately it’s not until we’re already locked into the balances and you’re long gone.

32. REPLY DIRECTED TO CURRENT EDMC AR…..Nice try sidestepping the real issue and trying to focus on “the student” aka revenue. The UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE has joined suit in the complaint filed against EDMC that they FALSELY certified compliance with provisions of FEDERAL LAW. You can blow your sunshine about how the company wants success but don’t bother trying to mask the truth….their success is not being measured by the mean GPA of their students. It is measured by dollars equivalent to enrollment numbers! It is irrespective if the student is successful in their courses much less gainfully employed after a virtually Ivy League priced education. Additionally Current EDMC AR, give it a rest about “your” students. Talk to the AC that is forced to babysit over 700 students that have to keep tabs on the majority of what you enroll and field calls from “students” asking where their stipend checks are, students that don’t know what a peripheral device like a mouse is used for….I could go on and on over the ridiculous tasks an AC has to manage after you have ENROLLED. Don’t you dare pretend you have ANY ownership of a student after the moment they have finished all their loan paperwork and completed their first assignment. The only transition of a student you are associated to is the one that counts as ENROLLED!

    And for all of those students that are truly invested in earning a REPUTABLE and sincere education know these statements are in support of you! Do not be duped into believing that this company has your interests at heart before their bottom line of profits. That is the difference between a non-profit University and a company like EDMC. The amount of money you pay for that degree should warrant a true interest in the achievements and success of their students not the profit margin. I don’t know any non-profit traditional university that hires people to call their students and ask them why they haven’t been to class and if there is anything they can do to get them motivated. For those students that understand their responsibilities and are devoted to the potential an education brings in life…..now might be a good time to evaluate another university.

33. REPLY DIRECTED TO REALLY? That’s even more brilliant. Puss out on doing the right thing out of fear of a trickle down effect and even more people being impacted. Doing the right thing isn’t always easy and it would be easier if there wasn’t a world full of cowards that have forgotten what the word accountability truly means. If more of us were out there doing the right thing, this type of company would never have earned a profit. Take your personal fears and avoidance of encouraging others to do what is right that you attempt to hide by some ass backwards economic logic and shove it.

34. Students have a responsibility to choose the education that’s right for them. Sometimes it’s a vo-tech under a for-profit umbrella like EDMC. Syudents also have a responsibility to handle their own finances, which includes the loan/lending process.
    Companies like EDMC exist because they fill a bhusiness need, and there’s nothing wrong with making a profit in our society. If EDMC (and others like them) are profiting illegally or unethically, they will be caught and will have to pay the piper, but in the meantime, stop bashing capitalism.

35. Larry, I could understand financial responsibility if it was FAIR. Students are not aware the student loans have no consumer rights or that the stats are twisted. Especially when your own CEO says the reason that your enrollments are dropping is because students are being more informed/and are consulting with parents and then deciding not to go. Its pretty bad that the reason enrollment dropped would be because parents say so. That’s a sign that the product has NO value. Need to see what I’m talking about?

    This is from the earnings call in October:

    “For the students at The Art Institute who went through the application process and then kind of towards the last minute decided not to start. Do you have any sense of whether or not they’re choosing to go to another school? Or are they just deciding not to go to school? I’m particularly curious for that around traditional-aged students?” – Sara BuBins of Bank of America, October 27, 2011

    Well, we haven’t had any indication yet that they’re choosing other schools, speaking of The Art Institute. What we’re finding is that, again, you have several things working against them.

    >>One is the current economic trends that are out there, it’s — and I’ll again — as you know there are — many of them are traditional-aged students. They rely on parental and family support and so that is a challenge for them. So that plays into it, as well as the fact that these students are — many of them involving their parents in the decision and therefore, probably taking their time making the decision given again, some of the negative press and other things.<< Although, we feel like we are successful when we get a chance to get in front of them to help offset that. But you just have several different factors working against them that way. And then again, understanding again, the role of an enrollment counselor, given the new compensation plan and their ability to continue to work with those students. That’s something, I think — we think we’re going to work through. But those are just several factors that we think are affecting the start rate. -Todd S Nelson, EDMC CEO, October 27, 2011

36. Mike,

    There are many other reasons student enrollments could be down other than people just being ‘informed’, as you put it. Have you also contemplated the fact that students could also be ‘misinformed’ by the very people who seem to be informing them; aka the news, the GAO who falsified data on for-profits in their investigation, the Department of Education who recently got caught omitting data in regards to borrowing/repayment trends among students? You seem to talk a good game but only have speculation and misguided logic to back it up. In regards to the lawsuit against EDMC; EDMC is the second largest for-profit school in the U.S., the government and Obama administration are looking to cripple the for-profit industry and are looking for someone to make an example out of, EDMC it so happens is currently in their crosshairs. When you have the federal government looking to dismantle an industry, you will have students that are ‘misinformed’ as to what for-profit schools are all about. Additionally, there have been some 30 other cases in relation to the lawsuit against EDMC; not one of the Courts sided with the plaintiffs if the case wasn’t thrown out beforehand.

    Moreover, how is student lending and financial aid not fair? When students sign up for school, they are presented with and have to sign and enrollment agreement which shows tuition charges and their rights and responsibilities as an enrolled student. When going through financial aid, they have to complete entrance counseling and a master promissory note which explains rights and responsibilities as a student loan borrower, and the fact that the master promissory note is a contract between them and the government to pay any student loans back that were applied towards their tuition. After being awarded financial aid, the student is then presented with a financial aid award letter explaining and outlining applicable charges and any funding that was applied to their tuition. Again, with all this information, how is it not fair?

37. @Current edmc AR
    All that sounds good but in reality its NOT TRUE. This is a typical pro EDMC sheep. The FACT is people were NOT ONLY fired because of performance, some people were fired for an unknown reason. In some situation the people who were fired were hard workers and high performers. In many situations there was no rhyme or reason to why people were fired. There was a disproportionally high number of African Americans that were fired. Can you explain that? Also, people were blatnetly lied to by Carla Caldwell about how they would be fired. She said she would personally tell everyone if there were being let go (which didn’t happen), and she also said that there would be DOUBLE the severence package than people were actually ‘offered’. EDMC is one of the most corrupt business organizations in this country. There is RAMPANT drug use there even during WORK HOURS. People who cut corners and mislead students are not only rewarded by higher pay but the often are the ones who are promoted. The VAST majority of students who attend classes online don’t even make it through the FIRST QUARTER. ETHICS is important in ANY business but even more so with ‘education’. If you could even call the online program an ‘education’ considering they are going to start to cut programs because they haven’t educated ANYONE. How many graduates does FRM have? Or HRM? I could literally go on for days about EDMC but the sad thing current edmc ar is that YOU ALREADY KNOW. You and people like you need to stop sucking from the corporate teet and go out and get a REAL JOB. You and people like you sweeing thigns under the rug brought this company to its current state. BITCH.

38. EDMC is the 5th largest employer in the Pittsburgh area. If they are shut down and all of those jobs are lost will it have a serious effect on Pittsburgh? Probably. When US Airways pull their hub out after 9-11 and they laid off a ton of workers it certainly had an effect. When the mills closed and thousands of jobs were lost it certainly had an effect but the region bounced back. We diversified in industries but we made the mistake of allowing large companies to monopolize the jobs in those industries. This should make us realize that we need to diversify in the number of employers as well and Pittsburgh will be stronger for it.

    Oh course that doen’t matter to the people who were laid off. The effect that being fired has on the individual is huge and as much as we are working to shut EDMC down we are genuinely sorry for those who have to face the difficulties of unemployment.

    We’re sorry because we understand what not having a job is like, what being in serious inescapable debt is like, what it means to face uncertainty is like. Many of us are there or have been through it recent enough that we understand how that feels and how difficult it is.

    We’re sorry because even if we have a job, even a well paying job, we still can’t make ends meet because of the enormous debt that EDMC has left us in.

    We have responsibility for our predicament, true, and you won’t hear me say otherwise. It’s exactly that responsibility that is driving us to take the actions we are taking. We are working to prevent others from facing the same fate we face.

    So let’s talk about responsibility for a second because we didn’t exactly get taken by a Nigerian prince armed only with a poorly written email. We got taken in by you.

    We got taken in by slick commercials, slick websites & seo, and slick mailers. We got taken in by sales people that come to our high-schools. We got taken in by the constant phone calls, the pain-points, the unrelenting pressure put on us and all the talk of how successful we’d be if we just had that piece of paper.

    We got taken in because we were told that because the government is tough on for-profit schools they have high job placement and that those jobs are in the field that we study and that they’d be entry level but that we’d be paid well enough that we could pay our bills.

    We were told these things and much more by you, by sales people, people being paid better than many airline pilots, pharmacists, and physicians!!!

    We got taken in because EDMC taught you to target us, the easy marks. They taught you to look for and exploit those of us that are on the fringe, the stonners, the emo kids, the poor kids, the kid who’d be the first in her family to go to college. They taught you to target people that are less likely to be educated about their choices and that are easy to fool and manipulate.

    That’s what we have to take responsibility for – being fools. What do you have to take responsibility for?

    Up against a well paid high-pressure sales person armed with psychological training and years of research about how to sell how is a 17 year old pot-head that likes to draw rather than taking notes, the child of a single mother working two jobs who herself never went to college going to stand a chance?

    We’re taking responsibility for being fools. Our efforts in the law suit, our protesting open houses, our emails and facebook messages to potential students, our visits to our high-schools to counter EDMC’s visits – that’s us taking responsibility. Our work with ex-employees, all of it – that’s us taking responsibility.

    Will loosing all of those jobs hurt Pittsburgh? Probably but this city will survive and rebound. Will loosing your job hurt you? Probably and we feel for you. But while we feel for you (even as you didn’t care enough to not trick us into going to EDMC’s “schools”), we are focused on stopping these profiteering sociopaths that paid you hundreds of thousands of dollars so they could steal from us because for every one of your jobs lost there are thousands of us facing a worse future. For every $100k+ you took home there are a thousand of us facing similar amounts of debt plus interest, and for every job that remains at EDMC there is the potential for much more damage to be done to more kids, more people trying to better their lives only to have them ruined by EDMC.

    None of us want to see 20k+ jobs lost in the Pittsburgh area but your jobs were equivalent to giving people cancer, a financial cancer, but a cancer nonetheless. While we feel for you personally it won’t change our resolve to end the profiteering, to end the abuse, and to bring down EDMC and stop this cancer, this plague they’ve profit off of.

    Good luck to you all – we hope you all find work again soon for a company that is not toxic, one that provides a benefit to society rather than feeding off of it like EDMC and their Goldman Sachs overlords do.

39. @ Mike…who the hell are you and what affiliation to EDMC do you have? Your assumptions are NOT correct and exactly where are you getting all this supposed information from conference calls? If for whatever reason you’re a student that is just so lonely that you do nothing but research information on the school that your attending jus to bash them….then your not very smart. If you’re a current employee then by simply putting your real name I can’t wait to see you fired for…not being smart period.
    Now if you were one of the people that were laid off I’m sorry. However being a current EDMC employee and one that survived the layoffs you should at least start to tell the truth. Yes the company is numbers driven…what company isn’t? Even if you go to McDonalds they have a “drive thru standard time” which needs to be met…if you don’t meet that time then there are consequences. Now I’m not saying there are reps that are putting students into school that have no business being in school…I and the entire team I work with (with the backing of our amazing manager) simply don’t do that. There are ones that do and I’m in agreement that that is wrong and they come from the old regime of when they were paid triple digits to do so. Some of them are no longer here after yesterday..some still are. I’ve actually told more people that they are not a good fit for a higher education then I have actually placed in class. I’m happy I have my job…I need it to feed my family and pay my bills. I have not and will not “lure” or “lie” to the students I talk to just to get them into school. I know I’m not in the majority but they are working to fix that as well.
    I miss all of those that were let go yesterday..there was NO rhyme or reason to who got let go and who didn’t’..its almost like they put everyone’s name into a hat and just started drawing. It’s a tragedy and I hope no more people need to go thru that as the way it was done at South University (where I work) was just soooooooo wrong. The fact is however what’s done is done and in a days time or so no one (except those affected) will even remember it happened. Lets get over it and move on so we don’t have to listen to uneducated un-informed people like you Mike.

40. Brian, as a student/victim of edmc/cec and now an advocate for others like me, i speak on hehalf of first hand knowledge. The gao report was accurate. Both edmc and cec used the same tactics on ME. Ive seen it. Ive lived it. Now i have over 83000 in debt holding me back from major choices in life like marriage and children. These schools are subprime lending. Its the same scam as the mortgage crisis except one major fact. There are no consumer protections or bankruptcy rights on student loans. Todd nelson doesnt give a care because he thinks someone can have a life with 100k in student debt over their lifetime like some mortgage for a house. He seems to not notice the facts that mortgages replace rent and student loans replace needs. These are real lives being ruined.

41. Edmc survivor, i am indeed real and a former student. All of the info i have is always available through the news and all calls are public on edmc.edu. welcome to the age of information. Google is emdc’s worst enemy. It educates better than their schools.

42. Mike,

    I worked for both EDMC’s Argosy University for which I am currently a doctoral student, and American InterContinental University (AIU) Online where I earned both my Bachelors and Masters degrees, a CEC school. I can tell you from experience that back in 2004 at AIU when I started working in for-profit higher education that things were a bit shady. Admissions was talking about financial aid which they shouldn’t have been doing and things of that nature. AIU eventually paid the price however, they were placed on probation from their accrediting agency the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools (SACS). Their probation was lifted a couple years later after fixing their wrongdoings. What people don’t realize is that for-profit schools have come a long way since then. More informed students by the schools helps to create better business and more responsible student loan borrowers. There are a vast amount of circumstances that contribute to a bad student experience or large student loan debt like you seem to have. It’s easy to jump on the bandwagon with everyone else and demonize for-profits but harder to concede that they actually provide an alternative for students who cannot/do not want to attend a public college or university. With $83K in student debt, were you able to graduate with at least a Bachelors degree? If not, what happened along the way? What were you told or not told that you have so much student debt and frustration?

43. Career education corp: false job connect promises, lead to subprime private loans from sallie mae and told they were fed, Incorrect associate degree given. Told to buy books never used, Substandard instructors, substandard courses Company tried to place in wrong field.

    Edmc: false job connection promises, mislead about private loans “from sallie mae our prefered federal lender”. Lied about job placement, lied about staff credentials, lied about entry requirements, lied about, encouraged student housing when not needed, housed students for top dollar at dorms at holiday inn, hired substandard instructors, substandard courses, encouraged students to stay in classes that were too hard, promised extra help, top employer on artinstitutes.edu: home depot. Told to buy books never used.

    All of this so they could extract the federal pell grants and loans. And this is just my first hand experience. I know hundeds of others

44. Mike,

    I’m not doubting that happened to you with promises and misleading information. I could however argue about the instructor credentials at AIU, not so much EDMC if you did not attend Argosy; that however we’ll save for another time. You never answered my earlier question, you eluded to earning an Associates degree from a CEC school; do you have a degree and if so what is it? When did you attend the CEC school and for how long? When did you attend the EDMC school and for how long? This is precisely the problem, you can’t lump everyone into one big pool and say that for-profits are bad. There is accountability on both parts and everyone’s situation is different.

45. Cec: katherine gibbs who renamed to sanford brown owned by cec. Considering that career ed’s ceo resigned after other locations found fluffed numbers to claim title iv, you can certainly say my claim is legit.

46. @ EDMC- haters, @ Current EDMC AR, @ Hate the Haters- I am a former employee who was recently let go from the layoffs. And I can honestly say, a lot of those so-called managers, aren’t real managers. It takes nothing to be a manager in that company. Most of them don’t really care about the students’ success. All they care about are their salaries, and whats going to continue to help them keep those salaries. I’ve dealt with those managers who would try to convince AR’s (Admissions Representatives) to force their students into class, without even knowing what their financial plan was. I’ve dealt with managers that will tell AR’s to try to convince prospective students to go into programs that the student has no interest in, or that was looking for a program completely different.

    Being an AR is not based off of skill. Bottom-line, you shouldn’t need to be skilled at telling/showing someone the tools to help them be successful in school. It’s right there for them to see and for them read, all AR’s do, is direct them to that information. How do you hang your hat on getting a lot of students to go to school, it’s not about the AR’s, it’s about the student. Those managers, many AR’s, and “Directors” get excited for the AR, because the AR has a student on an application to the school. Not excited for the actual student applying to school, but excited for the AR who only directed them to the information and then said “your next logical step is to apply”.

    Ha! You all are brainwashed to think you are “changing lives”, “fighting the good fight”, please. When all you are doing is talking on the phone with someone, guiding them through, and hearing them make the decision to change their own lives. I’ve helped students make the decision to change their life, i’ve talked with students who really needed more than just a “hey, you can do it” speech, more than just to show them the classes in a program or the benefits in a program, but did I pat myself on the back? No, because at the end of the day, it wasn’t about me. It was about the student. I got happy for them, because THEY were happy they were making that decision, because THEY saw joy in the information they would be learning, because THEY were taking the right steps to changing their lives and future, and because THEY viewed me as someone with patience, compassion to their issues, and with a genuine interest to help them. That’s what I liked about that position. That’s what I felt I was there for.

    But, I was let go because I didn’t find enough of those students every quarter. Everyone who works as an AR, or worked as an AR, knows we don’t have 100% control over a prospective student deciding to go to school, that the law of averages plays a huge factor in finding students who really want to go to school. And they say everyone gets the same leads, please. If that was the case, then why would their be a need for a tiering system?

    If you think that’s me “hating”, then you need to re-examine yourself and your way of thinking, because all of that in which I just said, is the real information. I’m not bitter that I am no longer working there, because I know God put me there for a reason and for a certain time, to make the connections that I was supposed to make and help the students that I was supposed to help. But the way that company is ran is NOT right. Not 100% ethically sound. From top to bottom.

47. @TruthTeller, your rant is way too easy to rebut; as soon as EDMC schools stop graduating students, then you can say that admissions representatives are not changing lives or fighting the good fight, plain and simple.

    @ Mike, you never answered my question about whether or not you had a degree and how long you spent attending the CEC school or EDMC school which plays a big part in your situation, especially since you have $83k in student loan debt. You obviously don’t have to answer, but I am curious.

48. 2003 to 2005 cec 2006 a few months at edmc’s ai. No degree. They kept trying to milk more out of me. Edmc barely took any credits and made basics be retaken mixed with advanced courses. And useless bogus gen eds that were a waste of money that normal colleges would laugh at. I wasnt going to wrap a cosigner into it after i learned their top employers were not even related to the programs or temp.

    I finished at the cec school i blamed myself thinking i didnt have enough experience. Continued schooling at edmc in a bach program… Worst mistakes of my life. Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me.

    I wont let what happened to me happen to others anymore.

49. Anyone ever see the movie Boiler Room? Such a classic movie. Every EDMC office addition reminded me of the part when they are getting ready to switch buildings when the heat is coming.

50. 298 to be exact.

51. Wingnut (AKA Brian Kurkijan),

    Have you had any legitimate education after leaving blockbuster video to join CEC’s AIU and rise through the ranks in your high pressure sales position within the for-profit education industry? Have you experienced life outside of the Glenngary Glenn Ross atmosphere to which you are obviously accustomed?

    Are your “degrees” from AIU worth the paper they are printed on? Why did AIU flee SACS after being put on probation? Did the AIU incident trigger the NCAHLC scrutiny? Are you concerned about the legitimacy of your online degree from AIU?

    http://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/oig/auditreports/AlertMemorandums/l13j0006.pdf

    Ed

52. I wonder how much of Mike’s student loan debt was issued in the form of a stipend check? It must have been nice cashing the biggest check of your life? I bet you loved spending the money, but as soon as you were supposed to be held accountable and pay up…you go and pull the victim card. It’s was your AR telling you to over-borrow, I’m sure.

53. None of it went to me. It all went to the school. I trusted the schools. Why? Because I had no reason not to. Nobody questions the builders of a bridge when you cross it. No, it all went to Career Education Corp and Education Management Corp. And my fight won’t be over until either every last dollar is written off or the bankruptcy laws are changed myself and others can finally move on with our lives and learn from our mistakes.

    No I didn’t waste it. I was fooled into buying books that we never used, and more that they said we needed for our program.

    When I withdrew, you know what happened to the outstanding over-borrowed balance AI/ EDMC had pulled in my name? It was sent back to Sallie Mae because I refused to sign for more or get a co-signer for the remaining money needed to keep going.

    I’m guessing you must have helped some people ‘educate’ their bank account, eh “of course”?

    The school was filling out the balances for the students.

54. You don’t have 83k in defaulted loans and not ever received a stipend. Don’t lie. Next, textbooks aren’t “used” at most schools, bud. Not just the ones they made you buy. Also, once you realized they weren’t used, why did you continue to buy them? I agree that texts aren’t that important and that’s why I stopped buying them after my third semester and still earned a BS degree.

    Just face it, YOU invested in Mike D’s education and that investment was an obvious failure (or you wouldn’t be on here blaming everyone, but yourself).

    Now you want society to pay for your failure through bankruptcy. No wonder our economy stinks and our national debt is rising. It’s plugs like you not carrying your weight and writing checks your a$$ can’t cash (or in this case borrowing money you have no intentions in paying back).

    Just imagine how many Mike D’s are out there? Thanks for burning our government out of thousands upon thousands dollars. What a great asset you are to the population. Say what you want about for-profit schools, but they’ll at least pay up for their mistakes, unlike yourself.

    Occupy the Defaulted should be this country’s next big thing. Look in the mirror for once. You are the problem and it started with you investing in your education. Not Todd Nelson, not John Doe the AR, not Sallie Mae, but it was Mike D.

55. @Really?
    You are obviously uninformed. Todd Nelson is the biggest crook on the planet! He drove Phoenix University into the ground by doing the same thing being done at EDMC. Just Google “Apollo Group Lawsuit” Ole Todd needs to make those 20+ million dollar bonuses.

56. Todd Nelson, or anyone at the school, didn’t force Mike D. to go to college, ultimately fail at it, and then stiff EDMC and the government with the tab. Quit trying to point the finger at others when its you guys who suck just as much, if not more.

57. @Really – I could introduce you to 300+ people that I know personally who have amounts of debt similar to what Mike reports from EDMC schools with no degree to show.

    This amount of debt comes from things like the “kits” that are full of overpriced materials, r&b that is higher per student than the average flat price for the same apartment in the same area, special private student loan packages worked out between EDMC and Sallie Mae that by default come with a 23.99% interest rate no matter your credit or your co-signer and that students are told are the ONLY loan the school will accept.

    I’ve witnessed kids given loan refunds without the debt being cleared as a qualified education expense, talked to hundreds of people who were never told where the check they were handed came from, that it was an overage from their loan that they needed to pay back, and many that were told it’s “extra money” that the school doesn’t need.

    Were these people foolish to not investigate before spending that money? HELL YES they were but that’s because those are exactly the people that EDMC targets.

    100% of the people that have been screwed by EDMC will pay back their loans and the crazy high interest. Most will also pay loads of penalties because of lies told them about potential jobs. NONE of them CAN leave the tax payers or anyone else to pick up the tab unless they kill themselves. Luckily that’s not been a very popular option.

    So speaking of tabs let’s talk about who’s tab we’re picking up. A great portion of that tab pays for sales people making 6 figures, it goes to investors, it goes to grossly overpaid executives, it goes to Goldman Sachs who tanked the economy just a few short years ago and ruined the housing market (something they are clearly trying to do with education next), government lobbyists, seo professionals who can set up bogus blogs full of positive posts about EDMC schools (all of which seem to be registered in Indonesia for some reason), and the little bit that is left goes to actually educating the student and a large portion of that goes to a few good and a bunch of so-so instructors.

    Now who’s tab are we picking up again?

    What Mike is talking about is accountability. Right now we’re yelling at people who when they were 17 or 18 were sweet-talked into a bad deal. You want them to act more responsible? To show some accountability for THEIR actions???

    What about the actions of all of the grown adults in the situation – why the hell does Todd Nelson not have to have any responsibility? Why do the sales and financial scam, sorry financial aid, people not have to have any responsibility, why are the lenders not expected to have any accountability?

    I’ll tell you why – because unlike the foolish teenagers that they prey on they have millions of dollars to pay lawyers, lobbyists, and PR people to ensure that their only responsibility is to count the money they funneled through these students.

58. I didnt fail. I was doing quite good when i left. A teacher told our class that he hoped we were getting our moneys worth because it costs as much as harvard. There was so many red flags showing their operation is a sham.

    Quit trying to defend them, you sound like one of those mortgage crisis criminals.

59. Since ‘Really’ won’t use his/her real name I’d assume that it’s a well paid PR stooge.

    @Really – I hope they are paying you in the high 6’s to be working defending these sociopaths on a Sat. morning there bud.

60. Why do those 300+ people not have a degree? I have a few suggestions, but will let you answer. I know of course it didn’t’ come down to them not doing the work or changing their major a gazillion times and thus have a bunch of extra credits. I already know it wasn’t the 300+ student’s fault, but can’t seem to figure out who to blame. Maybe the instructors? The admissions or finance people maybe?

    “Told Sallie Mae was the only loan they accept”
    That’s a crock of crap right there. When I applied to school, with EDMC, there was a lender list. Did you and the other 300 people just happen to miss it? I’m pretty sure I had to click on a lender list or at least acknowledge that I read it. Oh wait, Todd Nelson, when taking your application, told you to click on the lender list, but not to read it and that he already sent you the link to the Sallie Mae MPN. Ok, it’s all clear to me now.

    Also, don’t sit here and try to say they targeted young kids, because the majority of those young kids are “dependents” and thus would have had parental/guardian interjection. But nope, can’t blame the kids or their parents, eh? Again, heaven forbid the failures take accountability of their own.

    And how does a business exactly target consumers who are “foolish not to investigate”? I’m thinking of selling beauty products or health products on the side and would love to know how to target to suckers. That’s easy money, baby.

    “Never told the refund check needed to be paid back”.
    What were you guys thinking when your Financial Aid/Tuition summary was presented to you? Mine was rather clear. It went like this:
    Tuition/fees/etc: $XXXXX
    Pell Grant: $XXXX
    Subsidized Student LOAN: $XXXX
    Unsubsidized Student LOAN: $XXXX
    Balance: $XXXX
    So when you agree to such an enrollment level, based on the financial aid you were awarded, you didn’t think the loan portion needed to be paid back? Those same loans you went through Entrance Counseling and signed a Master Promissory Note for?

    What are the overpriced kits you refer to? Are you referring to the thousands of dollars worth of software the students received for roughly $375? I hear you, they should have received the kits for free. No need for Adobe or Microsoft to make money to pay their employees.

    Way to go, Don. Keep fighting for the clueless.

61. To all you displaced workers out there – you were on the inside and thus, you have all kinds of information about the truth of how EDMC operates and leeches on the unfortunate to suck them dry of all monies now and forever into their future….you’ve seen the treachery first hand! DO SOMETHING with your knowledge!

    http://www.consumerfinance.gov/the-cfpb-wants-you-to-blow-the-whistle-on-lawbreakers

62. Under the PA WARN Act, EDMC did not have to report the layoff – http://www.portal.state.pa.us/portal/serve&hellip; – That is why they targeted 400 as the # and NOT 500+ whereby it would have to be reported.

    Therefore, the press, City Paper, Pittsburgh PostGazette, and Tribune Review did some GREAT reporting to discover this and bring it to the attention of the public.

    Well done.

63. from a frustrated 2008 Bachelors Degree Graduate!

    Hey guys…I went to a state NON-PROFIT school and utilized the same exact federal student loan program EDMC school students use to get a post-secondary education.

    I’m really upset that, post graduation, I have to work my ass off to make sure I pay back my investment. Even worse my new girlfriend, who also went to a state NON-PROFIT school, has student loan debt to pay back! UGH!

    So, I was thinking about blaming a whole bunch of people/organizations to try and get these loans forgiven. B/c I sure as hell don’t feel that I’M the one who has to be concerned about it!

    Anyone want to help support my case? I REALLY don’t want to pay back the $40,000 I owe! MAN, this is such a horrible society we live in! Damn the system, damn the for-profit AND the non-profit schools!!

    OH WAIT….I’m not a pathetic peice of $hit that can’t grasp the concept of personal finances AND working hard for a living….never mind everyone. I’m off to enjoy the rest of my EARNED weekend!

64. Dear “Frustrated BS Degree Graduate”

    Wow. Your compassion is surpassed only by your ignorance.

    While you went to a “Non-Profit state school” and received your education for $40,000 – the victims of this particular “For-Profit” CORPORATION (EDMC) did NOT receive a quality education, one that is NOT respected by most employers, with credits NOT transferrable to any other university, and generally owe between $85,000 to $150,000 in student loan debt!

    Another major difference in your circumstance? YOU HAVE A JOB! One that obviously affords you weekends off! You want to know where the victims of this diploma mill are working today? And yes, they are likely to be working on a Saturday… assuming they have been able to find work of ANY kind… try looking for them behind the counter of Starbucks, Home Depot, and the gas station convenience store…or maybe say hello to that Game Art & Design graduate the next time you buy a video game at Toys R Us! By the way – EDMC counted those jobs as “Gainful Employment” in their annual statistics.

    The next time you feel the need to spew your half-baked thoughts, do yourself a favor and research the truth before being so judgmental on a topic wherein you are absolutely clueless.

    One more thing you are wrong about? You ARE a pathetic piece of $hit!

65. Dear Idiot aka The Truth Will Out,

    Let’s break down your weak attempt at a refutation…and boy is this going to be easy!

    “While you went to a “Non-Profit state school” and received your education for $40,000”

    (WRONG I actually have paid a lot more than $40,000 for it. After paying on loans for 3.5 years the amount is only now at close to above 40K but it’s SO EASY for a dumbass like yourself to simply gather that my PERFECT degree ONLY cost me that much…keep living in your bubble)

    “the victims of this particular “For-Profit” CORPORATION (EDMC) did NOT receive a quality education”

    (Really? I can come up with 100 reasons why EDMC’s schools are GOOD and BAD….just like I can come up with 100 reasons why NON-Profit programs are GOOD and BAD. The fact you can just so quickly act like it’s a “low quality education” shows a pretty high level of incompetence)

    “one that is NOT respected by most employers”

    (that’s laughable…b/c only a pathetic, uneducated person WHO ISN’T a progressive actually thinks that someone WHO IS INTELLIGENT/MOTIVATED/POLISHED can’t sell himself/herself to a reputable employer. Furthermore, any employer who actually discriminates against someone earning a degree online is NOT reputable, so again you look stupid)

    “with credits NOT transferrable to any other university”

    (how about we start with the word “transferrable”…well sir, the preferred way of spelling it is transferable – go ahead and try google’ing transferrable and see if it likes how you spelled it, dumbass. Now besides that, let’s examine the whole “NOT Transferrable” accusation. Well, if you’re talking about an Art Institute class not being transferable to a general education degree program that makes 100% sense to me and anyone else with ¼ a brain! In fact, if you attended ANY specialized education like that NONE of the credits would be transferable to a GENERAL EDUCATION program. The other 2 EDMC Schools, Argosy and South University, most likely wouldn’t accept credits from A.I. because of the OBVIOUS reasons I’ve just stated. The curriculum is simply different, not better or worse in value like you paint it out to be. The pathetic thing is, you went ahead and insinuated that ALL of EDMC’s schools credits were worthless. Pretty sad, considering that South University and Argosy are 2 tradition rich ground schools that only launched an Online division within the past decade)

    “and generally owe between $85,000 to $150,000 in student loan debt!”

    (I know PLENTY of people who’ve gone to Ground and Online programs that have paid 85-150K for a degree. If the students you are referring to didn’t graduate, OR have the monetary means to, that is THEIR fault! They should’ve worked harder WHILE going to school. They should’ve tried to find additional funding. Lastly, they should’ve used their brain to determine that they simply lacked the intelligence/motivation needed to secure the financial stability pre/during/post their schooling. I know, hard for you to comprehend this type of critical thinking. Oh, and by the way…the only program that costs more than $80K currently at EDMC is a Bachelors from Art Institute. The other 2 school’s BS/BA’s only cost around 65K total and if you’re doing a good job of responsible borrowing you can actually end up owing LESS than what I owe for my “better” education from a State/Non-Profit school. Gee, fancy that! God, you’re so dumb!)

    “Another major difference in your circumstance? YOU HAVE A JOB! One that obviously affords you weekends off! You want to know where the victims of this diploma mill are working today? And yes, they are likely to be working on a Saturday… assuming they have been able to find work of ANY kind… try looking for them behind the counter of Starbucks, Home Depot, and the gas station convenience store…or maybe say hello to that Game Art & Design graduate the next time you buy a video game at Toys R Us! By the way – EDMC counted those jobs as “Gainful Employment” in their annual statistics.”

    (I have a job because I understand how important it is to NOT make excuses, NOT blame others or circumstance, and NOT settling for mediocrity. I work an additional job/business so that I can pay down debts quicker and save money…oh wait, you thought I didn’t have to do that…ANOTHER dumb assumption on your part. I have a job because I GO TO WHERE THE JOBS ARE AND TAKE IT! I interview well, I network well, etc. and ALL of those qualities are NON-College related. You don’t have to go to college AT ALL to display the types of things I just mentioned helped me gain employment. I CERTAINLY didn’t get anything handed to me just b/c I went to a state-school. To think people in the real world have a ‘leg up’ on the system b/c they didn’t attend an Online DIVISION of a University is sad. You, are sad)

    “The next time you feel the need to spew your half-baked thoughts, do yourself a favor and research the truth before being so judgmental on a topic wherein you are absolutely clueless.
    One more thing you are wrong about? You ARE a pathetic piece of $hit!”

    (Clearly, you are actually just ANOTHER reason why this country has such a bad stigma and our ancestors roll over in a grave. I’d like to think that if we lived in the hunter/gatherer ages you’d starve within a month while I fed myself and other people. Keep thinking you’re “clued into” this topic buddy….you live in a freaking bubble!)

66. By the way, you can’t take out more than the aggregate loan limit for an Undergraduate degree. Something you MIGHT want to consider when stating that people have 85-150K in loan debt. For that to even happen they’d have to apply and get approved for a private loan. and if that happened how in the hell can you sit here and say they’re NOT 100% responsible.

    I agree with “College Grad” person on here, a quality read!
    Truth Will Out, you are pretty stupid, not a quality read.

67. @ Ed – I could probably guess your education based on your personal attacks. I don’t question my education at AIU as it was and still is a regionally accredited school as is Argosy University. Can you please explain your ‘wingnut’ comment as I feel it only fair to defend myself against your brash words which are lacking substance or evidence. I also no longer work in admissions, I work in financial aid for another for-profit college. You obviously have an issue with for-profits, so please explain and stop making general statements. What’s your real issue? Are you like Mike and don’t have a degree and got ‘duped’ by a/multiple for-profits? I would invite you to friend me on my facebook page so we can talk about it as you seem to make a lot of assumptions about my stance and experiences.

68. @Mike D,

    PLEASE DO NOT REPRODUCE!!

    Sounds ridiculous to say that, but any person who attends a school like AI for as long as you did with, you say, good grades but STILL didn’t realize the overall financial investment is just unbelievable and unacceptable.
    You don’t deserve sympathy. You don’t deserve to be the “voice” for students within the forprofit sector. You deserve a vasectomy!

    I’m glad you feel that marriage and family is now out of the question. The world will be a better place without idiots like you in the planet. Oh, and nice profile picture. A grown a$$ man with a nerf gun…wonder why you can’t handle 83K, don’t have a degree and probably can’t land a good job.

    #FAIL!

    How’s it feel to be such a loser? You know what you should do? Delete your fbook account and lay low…then beg AI to help you get back into your program so you can then try to make something if yourself. But hey, you’d rather be the “voice” of a pathetic argument/movement against an organization that is ten times bigger than you. Plus, I’m sure you feel like taking down your nerf photo is a violation of your civil rights instead of a smart PR move.

    Ugh….glad I’m not you!

69. I worked for the art institutes for almost 4 years when in october I was told my position was being eliminated.instead of escorting us out that day we were told we had to work until november 4th or we would not receive our severance pay.I had to work for 5 weeks knowing I was losing my job and even had to train my other co workers to do my job. This company is terrible and people on the outside have no idea.

70. @Really – most of those 300+ people I know DID graduate and do have a degree – a worthless degree that can get them the same job they qualified for before going to school.

    I don’t know why you keep saying it wasn’t their fault – I’ve never said that. I’ve said repeatedly that we are taking responsibility but it’s awful funny how nobody else has to.

    “Told Sallie Mae was the only loan they accept” – not crap at all bud. My financial adviser told me in 2003 before the news broke that schools were getting kick-backs fr doing exactly that. I was told I didn’t have enough in Federal funds and that I’d need to apply for a special loan program that Sallie Mae had set up just for AI students. When I logged into S.M.’s website and put in my school I didn’t have the option for applying for a regular signature loan, I tried after seeing the interest rate they wanted to give me. I called the school and was told that was the only loan I could get.

    I admit I should have probed deeper – asked if there were other lenders I could go to but excuse me if when I’m told someone’s title is “adviser” I don’t expect them to advise me on the best course of action. I was given no lender list and I spoke with several fellow students about that same loan where were told that was the only loan the school would accept.

    The majority of those kids come from homes where their parents either didn’t go to college or went to college 10, 20, or even 30 years ago when they could pay for it out of their own pockets. OR they didn’t even go to college themselves. When up against a fast-talking financial aid adviser charged with taking them for as much money as possible to fill the pockets of EDMC’s executives and investors masquerading as someone there to help why would said parents not take the adviser at their word?

    You asked:
    And how does a business exactly target consumers who are “foolish not to investigate”?
    I’m thinking of selling beauty products or health products on the side and would love to know how to target to suckers. That’s easy money, baby.

    They do so by pretending to be legit, by pretending to be working in the students best interest, they do so by invading an industry that has a history of altruistic behavior and not one of sociopathic subjectivism. They further are able to do so because they’ve bought influence, they have ensured that their actions are as unregulated as possible. Lastly by doing just what I said – targeting the foolish who believe (however silly it may seem) that schools are supposed to be a place of honesty and education, not of dishonesty and thievery.

    When it comes to consumer behavior most people are inherently trusting and believe they’re going to get a good deal, they also have a tendency not to read the fine print, (if you plan on selling anything you should already know this). Hell I saw students that could not read so how they’d be expected to read the fine print is beyond me. I had class with a student who was in one of her last quarters and had a serious short-term memory disability. She would NEVER be able to work yet they were taking her money. She probably will never live without assistance but they still admitted her and passed her along. Her mind made the charter in Memento seem like Raymond Babbit.

    What is a Financial Aid/Tuition summary? I never got one. I never said that I myself or anyone of the people I have been talking about ever thought our loans didn’t need paid back. As for entrance counseling – I had a 7 minute meeting with a fin-aid person after a two+ hour wait, then I was told to sign close to a dozen documents and reminded more than a dozen times that other people were waiting. My meeting was interrupted several times by other fin-aid councilors asking mine questions and my mother and I had zero time to read anything. We were told to sign things then and there or I they would not hold my place in my classes meaning I’d need to reschedule and start the next quarter and pay a higher tuition.

    My mother was working 3 jobs at the time I entered AI Pittsburgh. She had been downsized from a job making very good money just a few years before and as such had a fair amount of revolving and mortgage debt so she couldn’t take out any plus loans yet they told her to apply every time so I’d get more aid. They neglected to tell her that if she applied and was not rejected that she’d have to take out the loan she applied for – that there was no canceling it.

    You don’t need to believe me because you’re a nobody – you won’t even use your real name so consider this the last bit of time I waste on you. The facts are clear – I witnessed TONS of illegal and morally reprehensible behavior first-hand and have discussed loads more of it with lots of other people. You can try to pretend that I’ve said things I’ve not, you can try to derail our conversation, you can pick and choose what facts you want to brush off in your attempts to discredit and confuse people – none of that matters because the truth will win out. It doesn’t matter how much money these evil bastards spend trying to hide it – the world will know about the crimes and abuses laid down by EDMC in their disturbing attempt to milk the education system and the American public out of as much as they can.

    Oh, As for the kits – everything in my photo kit prices far less retail than what I was charged. Plus the cost was rolled into a loan with compound interest. In addition there were plenty of items never used in that kit but they could not be returned individually and by the time I found out how overpriced mine was it was too late to return it.

    I notice that you don’t dispute the cost of the housing. When AI Pittsburgh used Allegheny Center the cost of an apartment (no matter the occupancy) was $100 less than what the school charged each of the 3 students they put into a one bedroom. When you again take into account the fact that there was compounded interest added to that you can clearly see how EDMC has zero regard for the financial future of their students and is dedicated only to amassing as much profit as possible as quickly as possible.

    And @Really, (if that is your real name), keep on working for these sociopaths, keep on worshiping at the alter of Goldman Sachs, keep reading the ravings of Ayn Rand, and keep thinking that your money buys you the moral high-ground or the ability to bypass it because I’m going to keep fighting, we’re going to keep fighting, and we’re going to put an end to this company and expose them for all the sick and depraved things they’ve done. We might not get to see real justice (that is jail time and them being forced to pay back what they’ve stolen) but we will see the sun set on EDMC.

71. Don, are you kidding me? You’re worse than Mike D.

    The fact that you act like your “advisor” controlled everything is pathetic. The fact you had your mother apply for a Parent Plus loan and claim NOT to know what it meant after is pathetic. I went to school too…had my mom apply for a parent plus loan too. We BOTH knew what the hell we were doing and guess what?? Neither of us EVER used an “advisor”. Amazingly, we still found a way to NOT complain publicly after the fact and simply go on to try and make good on the INVESTMENT that was made.

    I’m actually glad you exist, b/c simply reading your statements makes me that much more confident that you have NO IDEA what the hell is going on in general…let alone with anything related to higher ed. Oh but wait, that’s b/c you weren’t taught everything first like 0.01% of the population was. You’re a joke.

    If I’m an AI student, I’m embarrassed you went there…not at all upset with the school.

72. Hey Donny! I’m thinking of going to Duq University. but their tuition ALONE is over 40K. Oh wait, I can’t afford it so I’m not gonna go. Boy, that was easy.

    Hey, my brother is artistic and wants to go to a private art school…not AI, but another one up north by slipperry rock u. He can’t afford it, so what can he do? Oh that’s right, not go there. Guess SRU will have to do.

    Now, how hard is all of this?

73. Btw…Duq is over 40K A YEAR! In case you weren’t already aware of that and figured it was a total degree cost.

74. Don’s just living in regret and that must just suck to be that pathetic. Don was following his dreams and failed. Nobody forced Don to go to private art school, but he was probably told by his mommy that “he could be anything he wanted to be when he grew up”.

    Don, please, if you post again, just use the handle of “Misery loves company”.

75. Whoa, you mean there are schools more expense than the ones EDMC owns? That can’t be right. Duquesne doesn’t have disgruntled failures either, I’m sure. Nobody ever signed up at Duquesne and then thought that it was too expensive. I’m sure all the textbooks at Duquesne are utilized to their 100% potential. No student ever thought, “this textbook is pointless” at Duquesne. Executives, professors, admissions, and finance people all deserve to make 6 figures at Duquesne, huh? I would bet that Duquesne graduates get jobs making 50K per year right out of college, huh?. No Duquesne graduates have a tough time finding jobs either. Only the EDMC grads, or whatever you call Don, have that tough of a time.

76. Don, you choose to have your Room & Board covered by financial aid. You choose to have your school kit covered by financial aid. How else were you going to follow your dreams of becoming whatever it was? Doesn’t sound like your parents were footing the bill. How else were you going to get a leg up on the competition? You choose to move out of mommy’s house and rack up debt on college, housing, and supplies. That wasn’t the school, man. That was you. Also, how can you sit here and act like making money off of a customer is a bad thing? That doesn’t make any sense. You want to call EDMC frauds and such, but let’s hope the DOJ and DOE see right through you and Mike for the frauds that you are.

77. I only have one regret folks – the debt. I have a degree that I was pressured into that came with 50k+ of debt some of which carried a 23.99% interest rate (compounded annually) that was good for one thing – filling the pockets of profiteers.

    What did the degree do for me? It qualified me for the same job I was already qualified for – photo assistant.

    That’s right aspiring photographers out there. You could go get a job working for a photographer, learn the business, and strike out on your own or you could go to school, collect a mountain of debt, and then do the same thing. Which is how I did it and how I’ve come to this point in my life. Which is making good money as a photographer but still paying for a worthless degree that didn’t give me anything besides the debt. By the way – my private loan debt, the stuff that nearly drove me to kill myself, is nearly paid off. My federal debt I’ll still be paying for more than a decade from now.

    No thank you, I won’t use a different handle because I’m not scared to tell the truth and stand up for what I say. I don’t need to hide who I am or try to redirect the conversation away from the facts, to talk about a non-profit school who spends their high tuition on their students because they are not beholden to investors or run by sociopathic profiteers, who’s focus is on providing education that they see as serving God – not, as EDMC sees it – serving Goldman Sachs.

    I shouldn’t need to mention that Duq. doesn’t employ thousands of sales people that are being paid higher salaries than most Pittsburgh area physicians and that are taught to use “pain points”. I shouldn’t need to mention that Duq doesn’t have a 100% acceptance rate. I shouldn’t have to say that Duq won’t take anyone with a pulse who can qualify for a loan because their focus isn’t on profit – it’s on education. I shouldn’t need to mention that their staff does their best not to misinform students and it’s not just because they believe in God, it’s because that’s what real colleges and universities do. They try their best not to misinform, they might make mistakes, but most don’t knowingly lie to their students like EDMC employees are routinely taught to do.

    Of course tuition is high at other places – that’s not my problem with EDMC. My problem is they don’t provide any real service to their students. Their focus is 100% on profit.

    Profit above all else.

    EDMC provides degrees that qualify their students for jobs they already qualify for (such as photography). They also offer degrees that don’t qualify their graduates for the jobs they claim they do (such as animation). They’ll tell you how they’ll land you a job at places like Pixar. A bold face lie.

    The programs that are left qualify students for a lifetime of debt in jobs that don’t pay well enough for 9 out of 10 of their students to pay back their loans and that is just the students that graduate. Never mind the students that are expected to fail, that are recruited not because EDMC is committed to offering a place to students that other universities and colleges won’t but because even if they can’t get the full ROI out of that student they’ll still take them for whatever they can squeeze out of them.

    So let me understand your world view – I should be 100% skeptical of everything and trust nobody. Sounds like one hell of a world to live in. Let’s look at home buying in your world. If I’m not to trust anyone then I better be a licensed inspector before I buy anything. I better understand plumbing, electric, structural engineering, know local, state, and national codes, do my own title search, and investigate every employee at the lending institution before I make an offer on a house. Well that sounds reasonable.

    That is not being responsible – that’s not how the world is supposed to work and most of it doesn’t work like that. Goldman Sachs world works like that, EDMC’s world works like that, but outside of the world of sociopathic profiteering people actually provide worthwhile goods and services because they enjoy doing that. Making a profit comes as a bonus to do it – not as the sole motivation.

    Now I know I said that my last post was the last. Well damn if you weren’t able to pull me back in.

    Now I do hope that this will be my last but I won’t promise anything this time. I won’t because I’m sure you’ll try your hardest to redirect this conversation away from the facts, to make it a personal attack, and to come up with conclusions that are just far enough off of what I’ve said to fit your goal of trying to discredit me and make it look like I am saying something other than what I’ve actually said so, for when that happens, let me just say it might matter greatly to you and the few people who will read only the last few posts on this article what impression people come away with and I’m sure EDMC is paying you a fair amount to debate me but in the end the truth will win out and we will bring them down.

    My only concern is that it’s done soon than later.

    The good news is I believe it will be done sooner. The fact that they are paying you, their PR folks, to try to discredit those of us working to shut them down is just proof positive that we’re having an effect. The fact that they need to redirect funds that would otherwise go to sales people or share holders is a small victory. Your debating me on the topic means we’re making progress.

    So no matter how you try to warp my words or how much you berate me I’m still smiling because I know the truth and I know that truth will bring EDMC down.

78. Why so much venom and anger on here towards those who have been scammed by EDMC?

    When did it become cool in America to blame the victim?

    Could it be that “Really?”; “Progressive College Grad…”; “Someone Smart” (ha ha, that’s a good one); “Feels Good Being Right All the Time”; “Successful and Grateful Grad…”; “Really? is right…” are being PAID by EDMC to cover up the truth and smear those who are writing about their truthful experiences within this heinous and heartless corporation? People with the cojones to tell their truth using their own names?

    Perhaps all these anonymous entities are one in the same person – someone with an agenda to kill the messenger so the message is discounted? Otherwise, what possible motivation might an outsider have to attempt to obliterate victims voices?

    Guess what “oh defender of corporate giants” and “slayer of victims”? The DOJ and DOE do indeed see right through the smokescreen…why else do you think that the DOJ and I believe we are up to 6 states now (5 and D.C.) have joined together to charge EDMC with 11 BILLION DOLLARS in FRAUD?? Now that we have a real consumer protection agency – we’re coming for you in other ways as well!

    We know who you are and we know what you’ve done. And NONE of us will stop spreading the truth until you are all behind bars. Kinda makes you pucker up every time you think about that, huh? Funny, that thought tends to make me smile.

    Karma – she’s coming for you.

    Have a nice day – while you still can.

79. @Really
    Clearly you are part of the EDMC PR response for damage control and you are not fooling anyone. Hell, I like you! I would hire you as an admissions rep as much bull shit as you churn out.

80. I’m not a PR person for EDMC. Do you think a paid PR person would call you a pathetic, cry baby fraud? I’m a regular, working adult who’s calling you, and your 300+ cronies, out on making bad decisions and then redirecting the blame to others. Nothing like shooting for the moon with your Pixar analogy. I went to school for one degree, but graduated with a business degree. I guess since I’m not the CEO of Nike, I should cry about my student loan debts. I should call my degree worthless. I should cry about my state school putting me up in a cell block (dormitory back in the day) and charging me for it. I should complain about the meal ticket, that I didn’t use everyday, but they convinced me to buy since I was living on campus. Textbooks, I already talked about those. Can you believe a state school would sell you a textbook, that was probably written by one of their professors, for $XXX, but when you went to sell it back you would only get $10. For those three semesters I bought books, I should go back and demand they credit me the entire cost. Oh and that professor who made money off of me for using his book in class, he should be prosecuted. Better yet, we should be stoning such a criminal. No way the professor and the publishers should have made money off of me, the unknowing sucker of a student. You’re exactly right, paying for a three credit International Business course was a crock of crap!! I had, and have, no intentions of moving abroad, but that state school, those criminals, made me take it. I’m joining the fight!!! Give me back my money for that International Business course those creeps made me stomach and pay for. I don’t do Human Resources, but they made me take two classes related to it. I want a refund!!! I want refunded for all my general education courses too!! What do they have to do with my business degree?? Physical Education??? Give me a break. What point did that serve my business degree? Furthermore, I want refunded for all the classes I took in my other majors. I was just a 18/19 year old kid, who was I supposed to know what I wanted to do in life??? This is just great. You pick apart EDMC’s education and I’ll discredit everything that the Pennsylvania State System of Higher Education stands for!! Who’s got Duquesne, since I’m sure they have disgrountled former students? Who’s got Strayer and ITT Tech? Allegheny Community College and Butler Community College, I know folks who have degrees from them, but are waitresses. I’ll contact them to join the fight!!! We’ll have an army!!!

81. Oh, no, you’re not a PR guy – that’s laughable!

    You really think we’re going to believe you’re not being paid to say what you’re saying. Right – even the people on your side believe it.

    I guess your name “Really” is just short for “Really paid well by EDMC”

82. I’m a parent holding a substantial amount of parent plus loans that cover the same sessions as my children’s student loans, including the private loans required to complete an extended degree program due to Brett Baker’s changing the degree requirements for an entire fiscal year. The changes in his living style reflect where the federal funds went to-and he is still program chair at Art Institute of Fort Lauderdale. He was allowed and is continuing this scam with full authorization from the management folks at EDMC, because it works to keep the federal funds flowing into the company coffers. My story is similar to many others. The reason I’m speaking out now is because I know that this life-time loan may follow me after death, and so I have nothing to lose.

83. I’m already a victim!! I went to college and have the same student loans to pay back!! How’s karma going to get me when I’ve already been gotten?

    I don’t even want to talk about the credit card debt I racked up while living away from home, at that state school, with no income. I was just a kid. Those criminals, the credit card companies, the ones who would give away free stuff on campus for signing up for a credit card, why were they allowed to operate and pry on the “too foolish not to investigate” crowd? Those criminals were allowed to stalk college kids and sign them up for high interest credit cards. Those criminals used good looking guys and gals to work the stand too. That was wrong of them!! Using sexy women to attract costumers! I’m smelling a separate lawsuit on that topic. Anyhow, soon after I missed a couple of payments, because they signed me up not knowing my income was zero. Then they had the nerve to raise my rate to 28.99% after I missed those payments. I guess there was something in the fine print about me not holding up my end of the deal. Those credit card companies were making so much off me, the sucker of a college kid I was. I was a victim, of my own decisions like Don and Mike, and now justice needs to be served. I’m going to include my credit card rant when taking down the Pennsylvania State System of Higher Education for the fraudulent education they sold me and the meal ticket I didn’t use.

84. There you go – deflect the conversation like a PR pro. When you can’t argue the facts because your argument has no merit divert – change the subject.

    Like a pro, just not a very good one.

    You must be the weekend staff they put on at the PR “helpdesk”. Just a body that’s good enough not to screw things up too bad but not good enough to actually help protect the monster profiteers by defend their depraved behavior in an effective way. In fact as I see it you’ve only given me a better chance to expose their wrong-doings. Had you kept your fingers off the keys I wouldn’t have dragged out half the things I typed. It’s going to suck when your bosses figure that out.

    I’m starting to understand why you won’t use your real name …

    By the way credit card debt is covered under consumer protection laws, student loans are not. You can declare bankruptcy on credit card debt.

    What happened to you happened to me to a small degree too. What’s really funny is that you’re mostly on point. There are people working to make it illegal to market credit cards to students. If you’re under 21 you now need a co-signer – check out the CARD act. Though to be honest it’s not really my area of expertise so I don’t know the specifics. By the way I paid off my revolving debt and the interest that was in the low 30s and now I have two cards that are only used for emergency and/or to keep the accounts open.

    If I had not paid off my card, if I made the choice to go in front of an impartial judge, to go head-to-head against the team of slick lawyers hired by the credit card company I’d have a slim change to have that money discharged in a bankruptcy deal but I’d at least have the chance.

    Nobody, absolutely nobody, can even get in front of a judge to have that done with student loans. That means that lenders and their cohorts (like EDMC) can run up the cost of education, run down the quality, and leave their victims with no way to even argue their case. This is exactly what they’ve done.

    So keep arguing that sociopathic corporatists should be able to do what they want, to who they want, and that common everyday people should be left to fend for themselves solely as individuals with no protection like we’re a pack of starved, mentally deranged wolves. How does one see that world view as appealing in any way?

    Though I will say it’s just perfect that you’re laying it all out there. You’re telling the world exactly what the people at EDMC believe. They believe the American people are all less than them, that they deserve to be had, to be taken from, that if they are too stupid to fight back then they deserve to be mugged and left in the gutter.

    That’s their belief structure but you feel that way not because you were born with the disease. You believe it because it happened to you so you feel it should continue to happen to others.

    You don’t defend them because you are a natural born sociopath. They made you that way. They turned you into one. They beat it into you that if you want to survive you’ve got to take, no matter how and no matter who you have to take from. Crippled people, children, the elderly, probably your own grandmother. Your disease is not a result of having no conscious, it’s a result of you being a victim of these same monsters.

    And like a child molester who was raped as a child you feel that that it’s the right thing to do not because it’s moral – you know that it is not but because nobody was there to stop them from raping you and if you had to suffer through it everyone else should too.

    You’ve become one of them because they took from you and you were not strong enough to face them, to fight them, so you joined them. They beat you like a dog and rather than run away or bite them you tucked your tail and you cower. Then you bite anyone and everyone else but your twisted and demented master.

    I now have a new picture of you Mr. Really. I now see you as the 13 year old Congolese boy with the machete fresh from the killing field, drenched in blood and out of your mind on coke and adrenaline. You’re not killing innocent people because it’s right, your doing it because you’re too scared to do what is actually right. Your too scared to fight for a world where they can’t do that to anyone else because it means admitting the things that you’ve done wrong and admitting that you were young and foolish and taken by these wolves – by these pirates – these filthy profit obsessed whores.

    That’s why you’re not very good at it – it’s not natural for you. You’re not defending them because you are one of them. You’re defending them because you have Stockholm Syndrome and are too weak to not be obedient.

85. I don’t leave my identity on here b/c its downright embarrassing to be on here. More for you of course.

    You see you are the person who has screwed up and chosen NOT to dig himself out of it, but rather cry like a baby and blame others.

86. and you must not be able to read – or you’ve chosen not to. I pulled myself out of the mess I was fooled into and I will continue to do so for the next 10+ years.

    You all are the same crowd that says a women who wears a short skirt is asking to be raped now aren’t you. Blame the victim – it’s so much easier than blaming the criminal.

87. Why is it embarrassing to show your ID on here?

    Besides, remember all you “HONEST” EDMC employees, your name is on those promissory notes and enrollment forms you fooled people on. We know who you are.

    And I find it hilarious that the victims are vilified here, much like the housing crisis.

    No, I wasn’t forced to go to AI or the other for-profit school, but I was certainly subjected to high pressure tactics like the GAO found.

    So go ahead and keep defending them, learn how fast they defend you when the executive team blame YOU for the crisis and fire you and take off in their golden parachute and you’re left looking for a job.

    I’m sure your next employer will understand that the fraud you committed was just ‘part of the job.” and will definitely be more likely to hire you.

    I’m sure they’ll understand your compassion for other humans and know you’ll treat their customers right.

88. “Really?”, Credit Card debt is not the same as Student loan debt. Its why these creeps are giving student loans to anyone who breaths and looking for anyone who breaths to sign up to their schools. Student loans have no consumer rights.

    Federal student loans are basically printed money to them. Everyone with a pulse is guaranteed. EDMC doesn’t care because they get the money and can send the students up river.

    You know what a majority of OCCUPY is and was about? Student loan debt. Private student loan debt, for which EDMC is a major cause.

    EDMC MUST be such a good company. Always taking care of their students. That’s why they’re DESPERATE for “GOOD” alumni coverage.

    Do you know why regular colleges get endowments? Because alumni are PROUD of their schools and donate back to the school to keep it going. They get government grants for specific things. Its because those schools have research and development programs designed to create technology or cure a disease/ailment. They put in the effort to earn that money.

    You can’t put the for-profits in the same category as those. You can’t even put them on the same tier as a community college. All they are is elaborate fronts to garner as much FEDERAL funding as possible. The private student loans they’re tricking people into is nothing more than extra funding to pad the fact that most of their funding is federal and they’d go over the 90/10 rule easily.

    Employers have been onto EDMC and the for-profit college scam for a long time. Why do you think most of the graduates who get jobs are the ones who already had a job and just needed the piece of paper to move on. And I’m sure they are even regretting it because the debts are too high.

    The media is onto you all. I just hope the government closes the books on you and you’re left to the true free market, where you have to show the consumers your prices and they go “HAHAHAHAHA” and scoff and walk off, instead of the hidden price tags and low standards.

    Want to learn more about EDMC?
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/14/g&hellip;

    http://higheredwatch.newamerica.net/blogpo&hellip;

    http://higheredwatch.newamerica.net/blogpo&hellip;

    http://higheredwatch.newamerica.net/blogpo&hellip;

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/09/educatio&hellip;

    http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/08/08/school&hellip;

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/08/j&hellip;

    http://www.forprofitu.org/about-edmc/

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/01/f&hellip;

    http://www.businessweek.com/news/2011-12-0&hellip;

    http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11342/11955&hellip;

    http://www.consumerfinance.gov/chime-in-on&hellip;

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/15/m&hellip;

    http://www.businessinsider.com/x-student-l&hellip;

    http://www.businessinsider.com/x-student-l&hellip;

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dan-lybarger&hellip;

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/08/09/&hellip;

    http://www.npr.org/2011/10/31/141870267/ho&hellip;

    http://hometownsource.com/2011/09/22/swans&hellip;

    http://www.journalgazette.net/article/2011&hellip;

    http://subprimejd.blogspot.com/2011/04/gol&hellip;

    http://floridaindependent.com/46718/art-in&hellip;

    http://www.pdnonline.com/pdn/news/The-Art-&hellip;

    http://www.indyweek.com/indyweek/students-&hellip;

    http://www.pittsburghcitypaper.ws/SlagHeap&hellip;

    http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/11/05/2488&hellip;

    http://www.bloomberg.com/video/63231858/

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/ed&hellip;

    http://video.pbs.org/video/1485280975/

    http://chronicle.com/article/Colleges-Figh&hellip;

    http://radioboston.wbur.org/2011/06/14/for&hellip;

    http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburgh&hellip;

    http://www.bendbulletin.com/article/201104&hellip;

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-28/f&hellip;

    http://www.cnbc.com/id/38412121/Greenberg_&hellip;

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/11/opinion/&hellip;

    http://www.rfdesignline.com/electronics-ne&hellip;

    http://www.pittsburghcitypaper.ws/pittsbur&hellip;

    http://www.ajc.com/news/feds-tighten-for-p&hellip;

    http://www.wcnc.com/on-tv/For-profit-trade&hellip;

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-08-05/s&hellip;

    http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10361/11136&hellip;

    http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11163/11528&hellip;

    http://californiawatch.org/dailyreport/stu&hellip;

    http://www.postgazette.com/pg/11023/112008&hellip;

    http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/stor&hellip;

    http://motherjones.com/politics/2010/09/ed&hellip;

    http://fortwaynehomepage.net/fulltext?nxd_&hellip;

    http://www.npr.org/2011/05/12/136238528/fo&hellip;

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-09/f&hellip;

    http://blogs.seattleweekly.com/dailyweekly&hellip;

    http://www.mediapost.com/publications/?fa=&hellip;

    http://www.wcnc.com/on-tv/For-profit-trade&hellip;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SU29jTJC7BI

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkOrwayYAUM

    http://www.tampabay.com/opinion/editorials&hellip;

    http://higheredwatch.newamerica.net/blogpo&hellip;

    http://www.mediapost.com/publications/?fa=&hellip;

    http://chronicle.com/article/Pawns-in-the-&hellip;

    http://www.tampabay.com/news/briefs/tampa-&hellip;

    http://www.Tampastudents.net

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_Man&hellip;

    http://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator/?id=13&hellip;

    http://help.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/Bitte&hellip;

    http://higheredwatch.newamerica.net/blogpo&hellip;

    http://higheredwatch.newamerica.net/blogpo&hellip;

    http://higheredwatch.newamerica.net/blogpo&hellip;

    http://judicial-corruption.net/2012/01/02/&hellip;

    IF Edmc is such a GOOD company and has GOOD schools, why do these stories keep happening? Isolated incidents?

    No.

    Just corporate spin and cooking the books to hide the truth.

    I can’t believe people would try to protect them so selflessly when they know the paycheck won’t be there all the time and they’re just a pawn to corporate cronies.

    They found victims who can’t speak up for themselves because by the time they find out its too late and they blame themselves.

    You’re basically being tools to Goldman Sachs who found another way to milk the Federal Reserve.

89. The degrees offered at any of the EDMC schools ARE NOT the most expensive in the country! That is just a fact.

    Just b/c isolated incidents occured in the past within the industry of Online Higher Ed you act like EVERYONE is dirty who works within the field and EVERYONE who goes to school is an idiot for being tricked.

    I love my job….I LOVE it when I speak frankly and openly about how to successfully manage your finances pre-during-post school. I LOVE telling students, “Hey listen, you need to be 100% aware of not just what’s out there for you to apply for b/c ultimately that is VERY EASY to do, but more importantly, what it means to responsibly borrow and ultimately limit the amount of student loan debt you have when it’s all said and done. Now, let’s start the learning process so we can get your level of understanding to EXACTLY where it needs to be”

    I LOVE not just showing them the cost per credit (easily a way to pull a “blind-fold” over people), but the OVERALL cost of the degree. for example, “Yes it’s 500/credit, but you have to times that by 120 and you have $60,000. So what we need to understand is how to break that down into the academic years you have based on length to completion.” etc. etc. etc.

    This process happens EVERY DAY. I educate people with the truth EVERY DAY b/c/ honestly, that’s the only true way we can still exist and can feel VERY GOOD about what we do.

    I sleep VERY well at night, b/c I stand for honesty and being upfront about EVERYTHING that matters in addition to the classroom.

    You guys would LOVE to hear me on the phone! B/c I DO NOT shy away from ANY of the “tough topics” like money. I hit it DEAD ON with my students. They are intelligent, they are empowered and they are scared yes….but who wouldn’t be when you’re talking about an investment of 50/60/70/80 thousand dollars?

90. You are a criminal. Your company is owned by Goldman Sachs which is well aware your “model” is based on numbers and not doing what is right. I know you have to get “aps” you are ranked weekly, monthly, etc. if you do not hit your “numbers” you will be fired. You are sheep & your profits come from people with very little to no education who take out loans then cannot repay them. You have to explain how to set up email, how to fill out Fafsa forms & do everything and anything on “start days” to hit your precious numbers. Yes your brain denies this as it has to. Yes you have helped maybe 1 of 10 students move ahead in life and yes you are a “plant” who was probably told by someone in middle management to write this.

91. @Read this – there are a handful of people like yourself. We know that because most of them give us information or quit after a few months when they realize that they are alone and that the pressure they’re getting to bring in higher numbers is too much.

    If you are as innocent as you claim you have to see it all around you and will not be there, and likely haven’t been there long.

92. “Read this”, remember that when you hug your kids at night. Knowing that you are ruining their financial future. Sure, you make some bucks now, but you’re just helping these scammers set up shop and continue to scam.

93. Go To Pitt,
    I probably know who you are. I was making “rank” the right way before you even heard about EDMC, let alone worked/faked/struggled there. I’ve been disgusted, not impressed and generally annoyed with ppl like you for years.
    If there’s one thing more annoying than someone who doesn’t do Online Higher Ed with professionalism and real ability to produce with integrity and sincerity its you. A disgruntled employee who probably was interested in stealing pay checks before getting fired.
    And save it if you say you produced b/c EVEN IF that is true, you almost certainly struggled in a very real way that led to your dismissal.

    Don, I only WISH I had heard of EDMC within Pittsburgh BEFORE I went to a western pa state school. I’m not knew, 6 plus years of confident conviction and establishing professional relationships with plenty inside, and outside, of EDMC. I’ve been an advocate of NOTHING but high accountability to doing things the right way.
    Hopefully Don, you realize that there is no sympathy i have for the lives I touch each day b/c I’m damn smart, and damn good at what i do meaning I NEVER HAVE TO feel negative things towards my students. Again, maybe you got duped but that’s not me and not a lot of other hardworking intelligent men and women. Men and women who excel in many other organizations companies.

    Oh, and hey “go to pitt”, that’s not a sheep, if I worked for the Salvation Army or Goldman I’d be the best, most honest, employee. You can’t really grasp that, again proving why I’d never want someone like you to ever be associated with my business or organization. Shame you reps Pitt in such a manner.

94. @Mike D,

    My kids will have a great future b/c I have the opportunity to set them up for success as individuals every night in addition to hugging them.
    Something that’s free to do, but hard work and doesn’t involve money. Can you relate to that? Probably not. It’s ok, b/c you probably have a whole list of reasons and excuses why you didn’t have that upbringing or HAVEN’T done it yet as an adult to your child or any child.
    Just imagine if you would’ve had a father or mother like that? Maybe you would’ve grown up to use words like accountability/hard work/value/sacrifice/timing…instead of words like scamers/crooks/liars. Feel bad for you.

95. If you’ve been there for 6 years you’re likely (as Go To Pitt said) a plant. Are you Really’s replacement – are you the PR night-shift? I hope you’re better at defending the criminal organization you work for than he was.

96. So for all of you that care so much about your students, why don’t you let everyone here know exactly how much you care …

    Where were you at on the lovely matrix? How many of your students are still in class? How many points per student? Why don’t you try and explain why you counted students as dollar signs? Try explaining how great you are and how much you “care”

    Just to let everyone know, each new student who posts in class ONE time = 3pts. So Mr. Rebuttal, let everyone know where you landed.

    Unsatisfactory 5 to 8 point
    Needs Improvement 9 to 12 points
    Meets Expectations 13 to 17 points
    Highly Effective 18 to 22 points
    Outstanding 23 to 25 points

    0-45 Ongoing Review Points
    0-30 1st Review Points

    $25,000
    $26,000
    $31,000
    $33,170
    $35,340

    46-62 Ongoing Review Points
    31-48 1st Review Points
    $28,000
    $30,000
    $35,000
    $37,100
    $39,550

    63-75 Ongoing Review Points
    49-57 1st Review Points

    $31,250
    $34,000
    $39,000
    $41,340
    $43,290

    76-88 Ongoing Review Points
    58-66 1st Review Points

    $34,750
    $37,000
    $44,000
    $46,640
    $48,840

    89-100 Ongoing Review Points
    67-74 1st Review Points

    $38,500
    $41,000
    $48,000
    $50,880
    $53,380

    101-113 Ongoing Review Points
    75-84 1st Review Points

    $39,500
    $45,000
    $53,000
    $56,180
    $58,830

    114-125 Ongoing Review Points
    85-96 1st Review Points

    $43,500
    $49,000
    $58,000
    $61,480
    $64,380

    126-138 Ongoing Review Points
    97-105 1st Review Points

    $45,000
    $54,000
    $64,000
    $67,840
    $71,040

    139-150 Ongoing Review Points
    106-114 1st Review Points

    $48,000
    $58,000
    $69,000
    $73,140
    $75,900

    151-163 Ongoing Review Points
    115-123 1st Review Points

    $53,000
    $65,000
    $76,000
    $80,560
    $82,840

    164-175 Ongoing Review Points
    124-132 1st Review Points

    $58,000
    $71,000
    $83,000
    $87,980
    $90,470

    176-188 Ongoing Review Points
    133-141 1st Review Points

    $63,000
    $76,000
    $89,600
    $94,976
    $97,664

    189-200 Ongoing Review Points
    142-150 1st Review Points

    $68,000
    $82,000
    $97,000
    $102,820
    $105,730

    201-213 Ongoing Review Points
    151-159 1st Review Points

    $73,000
    $89,000
    $105,000
    $111,300
    $114,450

97. Oh and for the record Rebuttal I never worked there. In the past I was tasked with attempting to help those fired find jobs elsewhere with zero success as the city has deemed you unemployable hacks… I’m talking about the 4 year and longer tenured folks who’s egos are detached from getting over paid to screw people.

98. Unions suck. Government was always more effective at improving labor conditions than unions. Collective bargaining created a whole new infrastructure to feed on individuals and siphon away their resources. Like any other organization, the union’s primary goal very quickly becomes self-promotion.

99. When my great grandfather left Slovakia in 1905 he did so because his parents, grandparents, and every generation they could remember before them were born into serfdom. They were the property of their landlord – slaves.

    After serfdom ended things got even worse. It wasn’t until after two world wars and the end of the cold war before things began to improve. That whole time unions were illegal. The Soviets are a prime example of what “government watching out for the worker” is. Governments don’t take care of the workers – unions do.

    When he came to America he worked in the mines. He worked only ten mile from where the Darr mine disaster killed 239 men and an unknown number of women and young boys who working in the mines but who’s numbers were never kept count of as they were not paid by the company. He worked even closer to Donora where the smog took 20 lives and sickened thousands.

    If he didn’t work at a union mine he would never have been given the pay or the hours that allowed him to leave Donora (before the smog disaster), to buy a farm in Ohio, and to raise his family without them knowing what it feels like to be considered property.

    Unions built this country, not with the Black Hand, not with anarchistic or socialistic intentions. No, they built it with the goal of giving their kids a better life and never returning to a state of slavery or serfdom.

    Unions won freedom for the middle-class, for union and non-union alike. The government didn’t do anything without intense unrelenting pressure from the unions.

    We’re facing a possible return of serfdom and EDMC with their pal’s Sallie Mae are leading the way. The unions may be our last check against that because as anyone can plainly see. The government isn’t going to do it, not when Congress is a subsidiary of Goldman Sachs.

100. Yeah unions are great for all the mediocre workers out there, but they hold back good workers. This creates an environment where nobody has a desire to excel. It’s very similar to creating a mini communism-like society inside a business. It looks great on paper but in reality it fails. Just ask Detroit.

101. As with any organization, there are some good people and some of those that aren’t so great. As a former Admissions Representative, I saw the whole spectrum on Penn Avenue. I left late last year, and not by choice. I’m very happy not to be there now.

     Yes, it was based on my numbers. They weren’t as great as they were as when I first started with the company. That was the thing that really got to me. There was a lot of doublespeak, especially by the managers. Nay times they would say that “it’s not about the numbers.”

     I found that a lot of the successful ones did have an extensive background in sales. The “sales mindthought” was a keystone of the organization. I was pulled aside in a small room by one the the higher-ups (now one of the Director of Admissions for the entire school) when I first started and was reminded that this was first and foremost a sales job. One of the daily morning meetings that my team had last summer was led by one of the Senior Directors of Admissions. I kept thinking of how meetings at auto dealerships are conducted after hearing about them. It was a “rah-rah” speech, and made me feel very uncomfortable. It was pointed out to me later that he worked at a local dealership selling cars before he joined EDMC.

     By the time I left, I didn’t feel good about my work there. There were many times where I would talk to people all over the country who didn’t have a computer to go to school. That didn’t bother my manager. The tactic that he told me was to get the student in class so that both of our numbers looked good. Some students couldn’t even put a decent sentence together on their essay, but it didn’t matter to the organization. I was let go only after my immediate manager reached his quota. It got to the point where I dreaded going to work and even approaching a prospective student on the phone. I knew, in my heart, that this wasn’t a place that best interests of students in mind.

     When I interviewed with the company I said that my goal was to help people. I was able to do that, but only for a little while. I felt relief when I had my exit interview, looking the Director of HR in the eye and said that at least I wasn’t being shown the door for being dishonest, disingenuine, or did anything that was out of compliance.

     I pray for my friends that are still there and still have to work in this atmosphere. As for management, especially those in the executive suites, you don’t have any pity coming from me.

102. Hey PR PERSON from EDMC – I am a former employee who in their 50 + years in life has learned quite a bit. When I was at EDMC – I had 5 managers in a (2) year time including a serious pathological liar, who by the way was demoted and still allowed to stay there and not lose her job. She lied to students and EDMC did not care because she got students enrolled. You know who you are Guys !!! EDMC has the worst reputation in Pittsburgh – I have been to coctail party’s where people state they have heard nothing nice about that place. It all comes from the GREED from the slimey upper management. You know who you are !!!! you guys are laughing all the way to the bank. Lets face it guys – 95% of the people there hate their job. This is so laughable. I have been with 6 different companies and have never experienced such a fearful place. That is how they manage by intimidation why ??? because no serious self respecting person would manage that way. The mgmt – they pay young extremely inexperienced people big money to manage unethically. They dont know anybetter and are afraid to do otherwise. They would sell their own team and save themselves if it meant their job security. They are robotic and do what they are told to do. Ha Ha – I was not intimidated and that is why I am out of that place. I loved the people that I worked with and as time went on I never realized the magnitude of the unethical behavior that took place. BTW – you must be extremely naive to not recognize what has been taking place for many years or extremely mentally challenged to miss all that has gone on. When people ask me about EDMC – all I can say is that everything they may read about it is absolutely true. Why because I lived that modern day sweat shop for way too long. Good Luck mgmt. – you will someday repent for your sins.

103. Never in my life have I worked in a place like EDMC. In admissions – total FEAR of loosing your job EVERYDAY if you did not ‘produce’.
     I hate being unemployed, but it was literal depression walking in that door everyday. The only thing that kept me going in the past several months in another role there was that I was serving students (already enrolled by other Admissions Reps) according to MY moral code to get through school. That is my saving grace from this experience – that I did not compromise my morals in serving students in THEIR best interests, not the company’s.

104. http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/14/opinion/why-i-am-leaving-goldman-sachs.html?_r=1&hpw

     Not to get too off topic, but this sounds eerily similar to EDMC, minus the fact that it ever started out with clients/students needs in mind.

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